Discussion:
Dolphins to Cancun
(too old to reply)
Dan Bracuk
2003-07-24 03:08:34 UTC
Permalink
mtbchip <***@cox.net> entertained us with:
:I wrote, perhaps to deaf ears, a quick note regarding the utter stupidity of
:bringing in these mammals from half a world away.

From where did the dolphins come? I have seen some off the coast of Cozumel,
rather close to Cancun I might add.

Were they also brought in?

Dan Bracuk
As Big Ben said to the Leaning Tower of Pisa, I've got the time if you've got the inclinaion.
The Best of Rec.Scuba
http://www.pathcom.com/~bracuk/RecScuba/


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mtbchip
2003-07-24 03:50:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Bracuk
From where did the dolphins come? I have seen some off the coast of Cozumel,
rather close to Cancun I might add.
Were they also brought in?
Soloman Islands, where the water temps are MUCH cooler, parasites and other
endemic maladies could cause harm to the population of local sea mammals.
There is NO WAY this is good, for the natural denizens as well as the
imported animals.
Hank Sweet
2003-07-29 00:24:04 UTC
Permalink
What sort of temperature difference are you envisaging? Coral only lives
in a very narrow temperature band and as both Cancun and The Solomons have
reefs I'd expect the water temperatures to be very comparable. And all the
dive destination information I've seen says they are similar. Or is there
some other factor here?

But bad news for the dolphins anyway!

Rgds

Hank
Post by mtbchip
Post by Dan Bracuk
From where did the dolphins come? I have seen some off the coast of Cozumel,
rather close to Cancun I might add.
Were they also brought in?
Soloman Islands, where the water temps are MUCH cooler, parasites and other
endemic maladies could cause harm to the population of local sea mammals.
There is NO WAY this is good, for the natural denizens as well as the
imported animals.
Matthias Voss
2003-07-29 07:33:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hank Sweet
What sort of temperature difference are you envisaging? Coral only lives
in a very narrow temperature band
Most of all, corals need steady temperature.
There are some big sizes reefs down at the norwegian shelf ( -200m), in
the mediterranean below the thermocline, where there is steady 14°C.

Matthias
DavidM
2003-07-24 03:53:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Bracuk
:I wrote, perhaps to deaf ears, a quick note regarding the utter stupidity of
:bringing in these mammals from half a world away.
From where did the dolphins come? I have seen some off the coast of Cozumel,
rather close to Cancun I might add.
Solomons. The advertised rate was apparently that the locals got $400 for
each animal captured. They were captured over the past few months and kept
in sea pens until they were all shipped out over the last week or two.
Apparently there were over 200 of them :-(

Cheers
David M
Da Parrot-chick
2003-07-24 14:23:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dan Bracuk
Post by Dan Bracuk
:I wrote, perhaps to deaf ears, a quick note regarding the utter
stupidity
Post by Dan Bracuk
of
Post by Dan Bracuk
:bringing in these mammals from half a world away.
From where did the dolphins come? I have seen some off the coast of
Cozumel,
Post by Dan Bracuk
rather close to Cancun I might add.
Solomons. The advertised rate was apparently that the locals got $400 for
each animal captured. They were captured over the past few months and kept
in sea pens until they were all shipped out over the last week or two.
Apparently there were over 200 of them :-(
Just to clarify: the amount paid was $400 in the local currency. That
converts to $60 US. Here's my source for the story:
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030722/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/mexico_dolphins_3
jer
2003-07-24 10:16:54 UTC
Permalink
Eco crime? Cancun amusement park buys 33 dolphins from Solomon Islanders
http://www.cdnn.info/eco/e030722/e030722.html
I'm wondering what may happen if those dolphins got out through a big
hole in the fence.
--
jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273
"All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of
what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Paul
2003-07-25 21:44:27 UTC
Permalink
I have been to the water park in question. I had issues regarding the
dolphins welfare and aired them with the "trainer" whilst there were
tourists there, and the trainer said the dolphins can swim away whenever
they feel like, but they keep coming back. I asked if the wanted to, how
could they get out? The trainer looked at me and didn't answer my question.
I inspected the enclosure and there was no way these dolphins could swim
out. I ranted at the staff, a couple of the tourists agreed with me but the
majority weren't bothered, as they just wanted to swim with dolphins. Some
of the dolphins had been kept in captivity for a long time and probably
don't know any different.
I felt it was a lost cause, as I really needed some backup, which wasn't
available at the time. This was a real tear jerker for me.
Cheers,
Paul
Post by jer
Eco crime? Cancun amusement park buys 33 dolphins from Solomon Islanders
http://www.cdnn.info/eco/e030722/e030722.html
I'm wondering what may happen if those dolphins got out through a big
hole in the fence.
--
jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273
"All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of
what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
jer
2003-07-26 00:57:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul
I have been to the water park in question. I had issues regarding the
dolphins welfare and aired them with the "trainer" whilst there were
tourists there, and the trainer said the dolphins can swim away whenever
they feel like, but they keep coming back. I asked if the wanted to, how
could they get out? The trainer looked at me and didn't answer my question.
I inspected the enclosure and there was no way these dolphins could swim
out. I ranted at the staff, a couple of the tourists agreed with me but the
majority weren't bothered, as they just wanted to swim with dolphins. Some
of the dolphins had been kept in captivity for a long time and probably
don't know any different.
I felt it was a lost cause, as I really needed some backup, which wasn't
available at the time. This was a real tear jerker for me.
Cheers,
Paul
I learned a long time ago that some people just don't give a shit
about anybody or anything other than themself and their personal
agenda. Why is anyone's guess, but these are the same people I love
to piss off enough to make them do something really stupid just to see
how stupid they truly are. Now, where did I put those fence cutters?
--
jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273
"All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of
what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
H. Huntzinger
2003-07-30 10:45:37 UTC
Permalink
So, How do we go about freeing these creatures? Obviously the law doesn't
work. Any suggestions please?
I'd love to outline how this could be done, but someone within sight
of this post may rat out any plan I could concoct on such short
notice.
This dolphin amusement park is intended to increase tourism revenue, so
the strongest message you can send is that its going to backfire
economically.

For example, you can start a "Divers Boycott Cozumel/Cancun in December"
campaign.

I include Cozumel as well as every other part of Mexico because the
dolphin import was approved by the President of Mexico. Find his
address and write him, telling him that you're not going to be spending
your tourist dollars in Mexico, and that you're boycotting all known
services and exports of his country.

As a consumer, there's nothing illegal about voting with your wallet.



BTW, Grand Cayman is thinking about starting a dolphin park in the next
few years...best way to stop that one is to make a strong statement now
against this one, and make your opposition evident in altered revenues.



-hh
jer
2003-07-30 12:10:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by H. Huntzinger
So, How do we go about freeing these creatures? Obviously the law doesn't
work. Any suggestions please?
I'd love to outline how this could be done, but someone within sight
of this post may rat out any plan I could concoct on such short
notice.
This dolphin amusement park is intended to increase tourism revenue, so
the strongest message you can send is that its going to backfire
economically.
For example, you can start a "Divers Boycott Cozumel/Cancun in December"
campaign.
I include Cozumel as well as every other part of Mexico because the
dolphin import was approved by the President of Mexico. Find his
address and write him, telling him that you're not going to be spending
your tourist dollars in Mexico, and that you're boycotting all known
services and exports of his country.
As a consumer, there's nothing illegal about voting with your wallet.
BTW, Grand Cayman is thinking about starting a dolphin park in the next
few years...best way to stop that one is to make a strong statement now
against this one, and make your opposition evident in altered revenues.
-hh
Well, gee whillikers, Mr. HH - if I voted with my wallet against
everything that way, I'd never spend a dime anywhere. I'm unaware of
a square inch on this whole planet that suits me completely. Besides,
it's a little late to be witholding my money from Mexico, I've already
done that in the U.S. Somehow you seem to have gotten the wrong
impression - I don't run a democracy - I run things the same way they
do - in your face and/or up your ass. I'm not an American so I'm not
gonna sit around hoping their mood changes, I'm gonna change it myself.

Let's assume you're the kissy-kissy dolphin proprietor... I'm gonna
get in your face and tell what I think about it. I'm gonna stand
around insulting every other client that even looks like they're gonna
drag their money inside your gate. I'm gonna make these people feel
like idiots for even thinking nice thoughts about you. I'm gonna make
you sorry you ever met a nutcase like me. And you know why? 'cause
if you don't give a shit - here's a clue - I don't either. I don't
like what you're doingand I'm not about to be nice about it. I'm
intend to be the bitch your mother warned you about. And while you're
standing around looking at me, you won't be looking around behind your
back.

The Mexican government didn't necessarily say they approved anything,
they said couldn't see anything wrong with it, (which I'll admit
amounts to tacit approval). It also tells me they're dumb as a stump
because practically everyone else does. In my camp, you lose points
for being an idiot, and more if that idiocy hurts my friends. Since I
don't see anything wrong with whatever we dream up, I suppose I'll
offer tacit approval for that too.

Nah, sorry HH, that dog of yours don't hunt around here.

Grand Cayman? yeah, been there, maybe it'll be time for a return trip
during my next bad mood. Which president screwed that up?
--
jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273
"All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of
what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Dan Bracuk
2003-07-31 00:59:34 UTC
Permalink
"H. Huntzinger" <***@huntzinger.com> entertained us with:
:BTW, Grand Cayman is thinking about starting a dolphin park in the next
:few years...best way to stop that one is to make a strong statement now
:against this one, and make your opposition evident in altered revenues.

Go to Anthony's Key, Dolphin World Marathon, any Marineland, Unexco Grand Bahama
instead, where the dolphins are already enjoying their capivity.

Dan Bracuk
As Big Ben said to the Leaning Tower of Pisa, I've got the time if you've got the inclinaion.
The Best of Rec.Scuba
http://www.pathcom.com/~bracuk/RecScuba/


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