Discussion:
A recent case of DCI
(too old to reply)
2003-08-22 22:57:57 UTC
Permalink
Cheers on the story. Why do you not include PADI's views in terms of
driving into altitude or flying so readers who are not PADI have a
better understanding of the information you supply?




www.mark.aunet.us - For all your Child Support Evasion Needs

Mark Francis Kennedy
36yo

PO BOX 5094
West Busselton
Australia 6280

0417024474



ABN: 89 166 741 894



######################################################
<3b6c1017$0$20936$***@news01.syd.optusnet.com.au>
income next year 100000 Au
Tax 48.5 %
maintance child support agency $36000
36% 4 kids

GST 10 % of anything I spend my income
$19000
######################################################

Search Result 1
From: Radio Head (no_way_spamma)
Subject: child support
View: Complete Thread (10 articles)
Original Format
Newsgroups: alt.support.child-protective-services
Date: 2001-08-04 08:10:19 PST


here is my future in australia , finished engineering 35 yers old

income next year 100000 Au
Tax 48.5 %
maintance child support agency $36000
36% 4 kids

GST 10 % of anything I spend my income
$19000

my thoughts on this Fuck Australia
I am fleeing this country to a country that has no cross treaty no
jurisdiction, and no fucking leagel recourse for women even in there leagel
system yep that right it is an arab state and I am proud of it ,

this country is going to the dogs and fast and all we can do is sit and
listen to the minority who are to fucking Lazy to get of the arses and work.
the above tax rate and CSA are not negotiable under australian Law . the
questions how can anyone say it is fair,
signed
me
QF 123 Singapore bound leaving now
fuck you all


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Nicholson
2003-08-23 07:20:12 UTC
Permalink
Mark

PADI is silent in regards to driving up mountains after diving.

In regards to flying after diving, they recommend that "a minimum surface
interval of 12 hours is required to be reasonably assured you remain sympton
free from decompression sickness upon ascent to altitued ina commercial
airliner (altitude up to 2400 metres/8000 feet cabin pressure)."

John
Post by
Cheers on the story. Why do you not include PADI's views in terms of
driving into altitude or flying so readers who are not PADI have a
better understanding of the information you supply?
www.mark.aunet.us - For all your Child Support Evasion Needs
Mark Francis Kennedy
36yo
PO BOX 5094
West Busselton
Australia 6280
0417024474
ABN: 89 166 741 894
######################################################
income next year 100000 Au
Tax 48.5 %
maintance child support agency $36000
36% 4 kids
GST 10 % of anything I spend my income
$19000
######################################################
Search Result 1
From: Radio Head (no_way_spamma)
Subject: child support
View: Complete Thread (10 articles)
Original Format
Newsgroups: alt.support.child-protective-services
Date: 2001-08-04 08:10:19 PST
here is my future in australia , finished engineering 35 yers old
income next year 100000 Au
Tax 48.5 %
maintance child support agency $36000
36% 4 kids
GST 10 % of anything I spend my income
$19000
my thoughts on this Fuck Australia
I am fleeing this country to a country that has no cross treaty no
jurisdiction, and no fucking leagel recourse for women even in there leagel
system yep that right it is an arab state and I am proud of it ,
this country is going to the dogs and fast and all we can do is sit and
listen to the minority who are to fucking Lazy to get of the arses and work.
the above tax rate and CSA are not negotiable under australian Law . the
questions how can anyone say it is fair,
signed
me
QF 123 Singapore bound leaving now
fuck you all
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
Cameron
2003-08-24 13:26:27 UTC
Permalink
Interesting story,

I am just wondering, what doctor treated this person with DCI, and when was
she told she should never dive again ?

Thanks,
Cameron.
I thought some readers might be interested in this (admittedly long)
record
of a DCI incident that occurred about twelve months ago on the South Coast
of NSW.
Three students were undertaking their PADI Advanced Open Water course.
The
students were a male in his thirties another in his early twenties and a
female in her mid twenties. All were apparently fit although relatively
inexperienced from a diving perspective.
The AOW course was conducted in Merimbula and Eden.over a single weekend.
On
Saturday, the divers completed three dives The first dive off the
Merimbula
Wharf was to a depth of 15.4 metres and the total time in water was 40
minutes. The second dive, two and a half hours later was also at the
Wharf
and was to a depth of 9.8 metres for a total bottom time of 49 minutes, A
further two hours surface interval in which time we had lunch was followed
by a third dive to 7.7 metres for 33 minutes. Following the dives, we
retired to the Merimbula Divers' Lodge for a rest and then a pleasant
evening meal together. All divers were in good shape and in high spirits.
There had been no unusual circumstances throughout the day.
The next day, Sunday, it was planned to complete the AOW course with two
further dives, a deep dive and a wreck dive. The first dive, to the wreck
of the Tasman Hauler, was to 29.1 metres. We commenced our ascent at the
twelve minute mark and slowly made our way up the wreck where we did a
five
minute safety stop at five metres. One of the divers, the younger male,
was
showing signs of being badly affected by the coldness of the water (16
degrees) and required careful monitoring on the safety stop. At the end
of
the dive, we returned to Eden wharf where we all went and had some food
and
drink. Our total surface interval was one hour 29 minutes. We then went
back out to do the wreck dive on the Henry Bolte, a dive site very close
to
the Tasman Hauler.
The diver who had showed signs of hypothermia did not come out for the
second dive. He agreed with the instructor (me) that it would be better
for
him to sit the dive out and he could complete the AOW course on another
weekend. The other two divers went for the wreck dive. This dive was to
25.7 metres and we started our ascent after 22 minutes. The total dive
time
was thirty minutes and again we did a five minute safety stop at five
metres. The dive itself had been unremarkable. There had been no
problems
and it was a slow and relaxed dive. Both divers were in good spirits and
feeling well after the dive although the female was showing some signs of
slight sea sickness on the return trip.
After the dives, the usual debriefs and paperwork were completed and the
group enjoyed a pleasant lunch together.
The subject of flying and driving (back to Canberra) after diving was
raised
and discussed. I advised the students of the PADI recommendations in
regards to flying after diving and emphasised that this was still an
inexact
science. We further discussed the issue of driving back over the
mountains
to Canberra and my advice was to reiterate the PADI view but to suggest
that
each individual diver had to take responsibility for his or her own
decision
in this regard. I further explained that, in my case, I would normally
wait
for about six hours before going over the mountain.
In the event, my partner and I head off from Merimbula sometime later and
the other three divers a little while after us. In the event, the time
between their last dive and the time they hit the foot of the mountains
was
slightly over six hours. About two hours later, I received a phone call
from the female diver telling me that she was at Cooma and not feeling
very
well. I asked about here symptoms and she explained that she felt
nauseous,
had a headache and she had pins and needles. Naturally, I was very
concerned. I instructed her to immediately go to the Cooma hospital. I
immediately rang DAN, spoke with the duty doctor, and he arranged for an
immediate evacuation (by a low flying aircraft) to Sydney. By this time,
the woman's condition was deteriorating and it was becoming very probable
that she was suffering from DCI.
That's the circumstances. What was the result? The woman did indeed have
very serious DCI and she spent several weeks undertaking hyperbaric
chamber
treatment in Sydney. She was not allowed to return to Canberra for
several
weeks, not allowed to fly for several months (meaning she had to cancel a
planned overseas trip) and told never to dive again. For several months
thereafter she continued to have deadness in parts of her hands and arms
and
has experienced other complications as well. Now, after more than twelve
months, she is relatively well but it seems as though she will never
return
to full capacity. As I said, she can never dive again.
Personally, I have gone over the circumstances in my mind many, many times
to see if I could or should have done anything different. Although I am
terribly saddened by the events I do not blame myself for what happened.
We
kept well within the PADI tables and we followed all the rules.
Nevertheless, a fellow human being suffered a very bad injury as a result
of
the diving activity.
I now have the habit of setting all my open water students the task of
examining the dives we did on the Sunday and asking them to see if they
are
'safe' dives according to the PADI tables. Of course, they do satisfy the
tables and the students, having completed the exercise are clear in their
mind that the dives would be ok. I then quietly and gently explain to
them
what actually happened and encourage them to accept that the PADI tables,
like all others and all computer algorithms are nothing more than
statiistical likelihoods. If they follow the rules, they are likely to be
ok but nothing in life, as the diver who got the DCI can attest, is
certain.
I hope others might find this story mildly interesting.
John
Robert Atkins
2003-08-25 13:20:21 UTC
Permalink
In relation to never diving again, I understand that she was told that it
would not be a good idea as her body seems to have an abnormally low ability
to shed nitrogen in the normal manner.
This is very interesting. How does this manifest itself? Did the doctor
figure this out from how (slowly) she responded to treatment in a
hyperbaric chamber, or are there other symptoms ("poor circulation" or
something?) which indicate an individual has a low ability to shed
nitrogen?

What about other factors? Were the students drinking the night before,
or dehydrated for some other reason? What was the build of the student?

Cheers, Robert.
John Nicholson
2003-08-25 21:44:12 UTC
Permalink
Robert

I have to admit to not knowing a great deal about the conversations the
doctor had with the diver at the hospital. I received the information from
her in subsequent conversations and did not think it appropriate to delve
too deeply.

As I understand it, the medical folk were very surprised bythe severity of
the illness given the circumstances of the diving she had undertaken. There
was absolutely nothing to suggest that the diver had increased her
likelihood of getting bent as a result of any action she had taken. She was
young, slim, fit, well hydrated and hadn't been drinking the night before.
The dives themselves were unspectacular and totally without incident. The
three dives on the Saturday were all quite shallow and well spaced out over
the day. On Sunday, the dives were significantly deeper but were well
planned and we kept to the PADI tables. I noticed that on our ascent I
didn't even manage to get any aural ascent warnings from my Uwatec computer
which is very conservative (more so than the PADI recommended 18 metres per
minute). The water was cool(ish) at 16 degrees but not surprisingly so.

All I can conclude is the obvious. Different people have different
propensities to get the illness. Personally, I have to admit that my own
diving practices (when not teaching, of course) are significantly more
'robust' if you know what I mean. Having dived in Vanuatu and New Guinea,
for example, the dives are repetitive and often deep, yet I've been lucky
enough to never experience any form of the illness. I know, of course, that
doesn't mean I never will. I am just reasonably careful.

John
Post by Robert Atkins
In relation to never diving again, I understand that she was told that it
would not be a good idea as her body seems to have an abnormally low ability
to shed nitrogen in the normal manner.
This is very interesting. How does this manifest itself? Did the doctor
figure this out from how (slowly) she responded to treatment in a
hyperbaric chamber, or are there other symptoms ("poor circulation" or
something?) which indicate an individual has a low ability to shed
nitrogen?
What about other factors? Were the students drinking the night before,
or dehydrated for some other reason? What was the build of the student?
Cheers, Robert.
Jon Mathers
2003-08-28 07:23:02 UTC
Permalink
Please correct me if I am wrong but the way I work out the dives and
pressure groups is on the first day No problems.
But on the second day a dive to 29.1 metres for 12 minutes gives you an
ending pressure group of G with a 1 hr and 29 min surface Interval this then
brings you to a B pressure group. So you are starting with a residual
nitrogen time of 6 min for the dive to 25.7 metres for 22 minutes. Adding
the 6 min gives you 28 minutes of total dive time. My tables go from 25
metres straight to 30 metres so useing the rule of playing it safe, we round
25.7 metres up to the 30 metre mark and the NDL is 20 minutes so IF this was
a first dive you would have been 2 minutes over the NDL but being a second
dive the ANDL is only 14 minutes, meaning you went over time by 8 minutes.

The emergency Decompression rules state:
If a no-decompression limed is exceeded by no more than 5 mins, an 8 min
decompression stop at 5 metres is mandatory. Upon surfacing, the diver must
remain out of the water for at least 6 hrs prior to making another dive. If
a no-decompression limit is exceeded by more than 5 min, a 5 metre
decompression stop of no less than 15 minutes is urged (air supply
permitting). Upon surfacing, the diver must remain out of the water for at
least 24 hrs prior to making another dive.

By my understanding you should have made a emergency decompression stop at 5
metres for as close to 15 min or more as possible, not the 5 minutes at 5
metres that I read.

Regards
Jon Mathers
I thought some readers might be interested in this (admittedly long)
record
of a DCI incident that occurred about twelve months ago on the South Coast
of NSW.
Three students were undertaking their PADI Advanced Open Water course.
The
students were a male in his thirties another in his early twenties and a
female in her mid twenties. All were apparently fit although relatively
inexperienced from a diving perspective.
The AOW course was conducted in Merimbula and Eden.over a single weekend.
On
Saturday, the divers completed three dives The first dive off the
Merimbula
Wharf was to a depth of 15.4 metres and the total time in water was 40
minutes. The second dive, two and a half hours later was also at the
Wharf
and was to a depth of 9.8 metres for a total bottom time of 49 minutes, A
further two hours surface interval in which time we had lunch was followed
by a third dive to 7.7 metres for 33 minutes. Following the dives, we
retired to the Merimbula Divers' Lodge for a rest and then a pleasant
evening meal together. All divers were in good shape and in high spirits.
There had been no unusual circumstances throughout the day.
The next day, Sunday, it was planned to complete the AOW course with two
further dives, a deep dive and a wreck dive. The first dive, to the wreck
of the Tasman Hauler, was to 29.1 metres. We commenced our ascent at the
twelve minute mark and slowly made our way up the wreck where we did a
five
minute safety stop at five metres. One of the divers, the younger male,
was
showing signs of being badly affected by the coldness of the water (16
degrees) and required careful monitoring on the safety stop. At the end
of
the dive, we returned to Eden wharf where we all went and had some food
and
drink. Our total surface interval was one hour 29 minutes. We then went
back out to do the wreck dive on the Henry Bolte, a dive site very close
to
the Tasman Hauler.
The diver who had showed signs of hypothermia did not come out for the
second dive. He agreed with the instructor (me) that it would be better
for
him to sit the dive out and he could complete the AOW course on another
weekend. The other two divers went for the wreck dive. This dive was to
25.7 metres and we started our ascent after 22 minutes. The total dive
time
was thirty minutes and again we did a five minute safety stop at five
metres. The dive itself had been unremarkable. There had been no
problems
and it was a slow and relaxed dive. Both divers were in good spirits and
feeling well after the dive although the female was showing some signs of
slight sea sickness on the return trip.
After the dives, the usual debriefs and paperwork were completed and the
group enjoyed a pleasant lunch together.
The subject of flying and driving (back to Canberra) after diving was
raised
and discussed. I advised the students of the PADI recommendations in
regards to flying after diving and emphasised that this was still an
inexact
science. We further discussed the issue of driving back over the
mountains
to Canberra and my advice was to reiterate the PADI view but to suggest
that
each individual diver had to take responsibility for his or her own
decision
in this regard. I further explained that, in my case, I would normally
wait
for about six hours before going over the mountain.
In the event, my partner and I head off from Merimbula sometime later and
the other three divers a little while after us. In the event, the time
between their last dive and the time they hit the foot of the mountains
was
slightly over six hours. About two hours later, I received a phone call
from the female diver telling me that she was at Cooma and not feeling
very
well. I asked about here symptoms and she explained that she felt
nauseous,
had a headache and she had pins and needles. Naturally, I was very
concerned. I instructed her to immediately go to the Cooma hospital. I
immediately rang DAN, spoke with the duty doctor, and he arranged for an
immediate evacuation (by a low flying aircraft) to Sydney. By this time,
the woman's condition was deteriorating and it was becoming very probable
that she was suffering from DCI.
That's the circumstances. What was the result? The woman did indeed have
very serious DCI and she spent several weeks undertaking hyperbaric
chamber
treatment in Sydney. She was not allowed to return to Canberra for
several
weeks, not allowed to fly for several months (meaning she had to cancel a
planned overseas trip) and told never to dive again. For several months
thereafter she continued to have deadness in parts of her hands and arms
and
has experienced other complications as well. Now, after more than twelve
months, she is relatively well but it seems as though she will never
return
to full capacity. As I said, she can never dive again.
Personally, I have gone over the circumstances in my mind many, many times
to see if I could or should have done anything different. Although I am
terribly saddened by the events I do not blame myself for what happened.
We
kept well within the PADI tables and we followed all the rules.
Nevertheless, a fellow human being suffered a very bad injury as a result
of
the diving activity.
I now have the habit of setting all my open water students the task of
examining the dives we did on the Sunday and asking them to see if they
are
'safe' dives according to the PADI tables. Of course, they do satisfy the
tables and the students, having completed the exercise are clear in their
mind that the dives would be ok. I then quietly and gently explain to
them
what actually happened and encourage them to accept that the PADI tables,
like all others and all computer algorithms are nothing more than
statiistical likelihoods. If they follow the rules, they are likely to be
ok but nothing in life, as the diver who got the DCI can attest, is
certain.
I hope others might find this story mildly interesting.
John
John Nicholson
2003-08-28 08:36:29 UTC
Permalink
Jon

Thanks for your email. The point you make is a very good one.

In the case in question, all the divers were operating on the PADI wheel
which allows significantly more exact determinations as it doesn't round up
quite so dramatically as do the tables.

Another point is that I make a habit of staying slightly below my students
throughout the dive with my divemaster above them. I doubt that any of the
divers got as low as even 24 metres on the second dive.

I might also add that my dive computer, a Uwatec, showed a minimum no stop
time of 25 minutes for the second dive. In other words, it was prepared to
let me stay at 25.7 metres for a further 25 minutes before telling me that I
needed to decompress.

Safe diving

John
Post by Jon Mathers
Please correct me if I am wrong but the way I work out the dives and
pressure groups is on the first day No problems.
But on the second day a dive to 29.1 metres for 12 minutes gives you an
ending pressure group of G with a 1 hr and 29 min surface Interval this then
brings you to a B pressure group. So you are starting with a residual
nitrogen time of 6 min for the dive to 25.7 metres for 22 minutes. Adding
the 6 min gives you 28 minutes of total dive time. My tables go from 25
metres straight to 30 metres so useing the rule of playing it safe, we round
25.7 metres up to the 30 metre mark and the NDL is 20 minutes so IF this was
a first dive you would have been 2 minutes over the NDL but being a second
dive the ANDL is only 14 minutes, meaning you went over time by 8 minutes.
If a no-decompression limed is exceeded by no more than 5 mins, an 8 min
decompression stop at 5 metres is mandatory. Upon surfacing, the diver must
remain out of the water for at least 6 hrs prior to making another dive. If
a no-decompression limit is exceeded by more than 5 min, a 5 metre
decompression stop of no less than 15 minutes is urged (air supply
permitting). Upon surfacing, the diver must remain out of the water for at
least 24 hrs prior to making another dive.
By my understanding you should have made a emergency decompression stop at 5
metres for as close to 15 min or more as possible, not the 5 minutes at 5
metres that I read.
Regards
Jon Mathers
I thought some readers might be interested in this (admittedly long)
record
of a DCI incident that occurred about twelve months ago on the South Coast
of NSW.
Three students were undertaking their PADI Advanced Open Water course.
The
students were a male in his thirties another in his early twenties and a
female in her mid twenties. All were apparently fit although relatively
inexperienced from a diving perspective.
The AOW course was conducted in Merimbula and Eden.over a single weekend.
On
Saturday, the divers completed three dives The first dive off the
Merimbula
Wharf was to a depth of 15.4 metres and the total time in water was 40
minutes. The second dive, two and a half hours later was also at the
Wharf
and was to a depth of 9.8 metres for a total bottom time of 49 minutes,
A
Post by Jon Mathers
further two hours surface interval in which time we had lunch was followed
by a third dive to 7.7 metres for 33 minutes. Following the dives, we
retired to the Merimbula Divers' Lodge for a rest and then a pleasant
evening meal together. All divers were in good shape and in high spirits.
There had been no unusual circumstances throughout the day.
The next day, Sunday, it was planned to complete the AOW course with two
further dives, a deep dive and a wreck dive. The first dive, to the wreck
of the Tasman Hauler, was to 29.1 metres. We commenced our ascent at the
twelve minute mark and slowly made our way up the wreck where we did a
five
minute safety stop at five metres. One of the divers, the younger male,
was
showing signs of being badly affected by the coldness of the water (16
degrees) and required careful monitoring on the safety stop. At the end
of
the dive, we returned to Eden wharf where we all went and had some food
and
drink. Our total surface interval was one hour 29 minutes. We then went
back out to do the wreck dive on the Henry Bolte, a dive site very close
to
the Tasman Hauler.
The diver who had showed signs of hypothermia did not come out for the
second dive. He agreed with the instructor (me) that it would be better
for
him to sit the dive out and he could complete the AOW course on another
weekend. The other two divers went for the wreck dive. This dive was to
25.7 metres and we started our ascent after 22 minutes. The total dive
time
was thirty minutes and again we did a five minute safety stop at five
metres. The dive itself had been unremarkable. There had been no
problems
and it was a slow and relaxed dive. Both divers were in good spirits and
feeling well after the dive although the female was showing some signs of
slight sea sickness on the return trip.
After the dives, the usual debriefs and paperwork were completed and the
group enjoyed a pleasant lunch together.
The subject of flying and driving (back to Canberra) after diving was
raised
and discussed. I advised the students of the PADI recommendations in
regards to flying after diving and emphasised that this was still an
inexact
science. We further discussed the issue of driving back over the
mountains
to Canberra and my advice was to reiterate the PADI view but to suggest
that
each individual diver had to take responsibility for his or her own
decision
in this regard. I further explained that, in my case, I would normally
wait
for about six hours before going over the mountain.
In the event, my partner and I head off from Merimbula sometime later and
the other three divers a little while after us. In the event, the time
between their last dive and the time they hit the foot of the mountains
was
slightly over six hours. About two hours later, I received a phone call
from the female diver telling me that she was at Cooma and not feeling
very
well. I asked about here symptoms and she explained that she felt
nauseous,
had a headache and she had pins and needles. Naturally, I was very
concerned. I instructed her to immediately go to the Cooma hospital. I
immediately rang DAN, spoke with the duty doctor, and he arranged for an
immediate evacuation (by a low flying aircraft) to Sydney. By this time,
the woman's condition was deteriorating and it was becoming very probable
that she was suffering from DCI.
That's the circumstances. What was the result? The woman did indeed have
very serious DCI and she spent several weeks undertaking hyperbaric
chamber
treatment in Sydney. She was not allowed to return to Canberra for
several
weeks, not allowed to fly for several months (meaning she had to cancel a
planned overseas trip) and told never to dive again. For several months
thereafter she continued to have deadness in parts of her hands and arms
and
has experienced other complications as well. Now, after more than twelve
months, she is relatively well but it seems as though she will never
return
to full capacity. As I said, she can never dive again.
Personally, I have gone over the circumstances in my mind many, many times
to see if I could or should have done anything different. Although I am
terribly saddened by the events I do not blame myself for what happened.
We
kept well within the PADI tables and we followed all the rules.
Nevertheless, a fellow human being suffered a very bad injury as a result
of
the diving activity.
I now have the habit of setting all my open water students the task of
examining the dives we did on the Sunday and asking them to see if they
are
'safe' dives according to the PADI tables. Of course, they do satisfy the
tables and the students, having completed the exercise are clear in their
mind that the dives would be ok. I then quietly and gently explain to
them
what actually happened and encourage them to accept that the PADI tables,
like all others and all computer algorithms are nothing more than
statiistical likelihoods. If they follow the rules, they are likely to be
ok but nothing in life, as the diver who got the DCI can attest, is
certain.
I hope others might find this story mildly interesting.
John
Jon Mathers
2003-08-30 06:40:36 UTC
Permalink
Doing the same dive profile with the wheel I get that the max time (ANDL)
for the second dive of the second day should have been no more than 20
minutes. I am aware that you said that you dived deeper than your students,
but I can only work off the information that you supplied.
I am just working these out for interest sake.
As a PADI instructor should you not avoid the limits, and err a bit more on
the side of caution, especially when diving with students no matter how
experienced they are?
Post by John Nicholson
Jon
Thanks for your email. The point you make is a very good one.
In the case in question, all the divers were operating on the PADI wheel
which allows significantly more exact determinations as it doesn't round up
quite so dramatically as do the tables.
Another point is that I make a habit of staying slightly below my students
throughout the dive with my divemaster above them. I doubt that any of the
divers got as low as even 24 metres on the second dive.
I might also add that my dive computer, a Uwatec, showed a minimum no stop
time of 25 minutes for the second dive. In other words, it was prepared to
let me stay at 25.7 metres for a further 25 minutes before telling me that I
needed to decompress.
Safe diving
John
Post by Jon Mathers
Please correct me if I am wrong but the way I work out the dives and
pressure groups is on the first day No problems.
But on the second day a dive to 29.1 metres for 12 minutes gives you an
ending pressure group of G with a 1 hr and 29 min surface Interval this
then
Post by Jon Mathers
brings you to a B pressure group. So you are starting with a residual
nitrogen time of 6 min for the dive to 25.7 metres for 22 minutes. Adding
the 6 min gives you 28 minutes of total dive time. My tables go from 25
metres straight to 30 metres so useing the rule of playing it safe, we
round
Post by Jon Mathers
25.7 metres up to the 30 metre mark and the NDL is 20 minutes so IF this
was
Post by Jon Mathers
a first dive you would have been 2 minutes over the NDL but being a second
dive the ANDL is only 14 minutes, meaning you went over time by 8 minutes.
If a no-decompression limed is exceeded by no more than 5 mins, an 8 min
decompression stop at 5 metres is mandatory. Upon surfacing, the diver
must
Post by Jon Mathers
remain out of the water for at least 6 hrs prior to making another dive.
If
Post by Jon Mathers
a no-decompression limit is exceeded by more than 5 min, a 5 metre
decompression stop of no less than 15 minutes is urged (air supply
permitting). Upon surfacing, the diver must remain out of the water for at
least 24 hrs prior to making another dive.
By my understanding you should have made a emergency decompression stop
at
Post by John Nicholson
5
Post by Jon Mathers
metres for as close to 15 min or more as possible, not the 5 minutes at 5
metres that I read.
Regards
Jon Mathers
I thought some readers might be interested in this (admittedly long)
record
of a DCI incident that occurred about twelve months ago on the South
Coast
Post by Jon Mathers
of NSW.
Three students were undertaking their PADI Advanced Open Water course.
The
students were a male in his thirties another in his early twenties and a
female in her mid twenties. All were apparently fit although relatively
inexperienced from a diving perspective.
The AOW course was conducted in Merimbula and Eden.over a single
weekend.
Post by Jon Mathers
On
Saturday, the divers completed three dives The first dive off the
Merimbula
Wharf was to a depth of 15.4 metres and the total time in water was 40
minutes. The second dive, two and a half hours later was also at the
Wharf
and was to a depth of 9.8 metres for a total bottom time of 49 minutes,
A
Post by Jon Mathers
further two hours surface interval in which time we had lunch was
followed
Post by Jon Mathers
by a third dive to 7.7 metres for 33 minutes. Following the dives, we
retired to the Merimbula Divers' Lodge for a rest and then a pleasant
evening meal together. All divers were in good shape and in high
spirits.
Post by Jon Mathers
There had been no unusual circumstances throughout the day.
The next day, Sunday, it was planned to complete the AOW course with two
further dives, a deep dive and a wreck dive. The first dive, to the
wreck
Post by Jon Mathers
of the Tasman Hauler, was to 29.1 metres. We commenced our ascent at
the
Post by Jon Mathers
twelve minute mark and slowly made our way up the wreck where we did a
five
minute safety stop at five metres. One of the divers, the younger male,
was
showing signs of being badly affected by the coldness of the water (16
degrees) and required careful monitoring on the safety stop. At the end
of
the dive, we returned to Eden wharf where we all went and had some food
and
drink. Our total surface interval was one hour 29 minutes. We then
went
Post by Jon Mathers
back out to do the wreck dive on the Henry Bolte, a dive site very close
to
the Tasman Hauler.
The diver who had showed signs of hypothermia did not come out for the
second dive. He agreed with the instructor (me) that it would be better
for
him to sit the dive out and he could complete the AOW course on another
weekend. The other two divers went for the wreck dive. This dive was
to
Post by Jon Mathers
25.7 metres and we started our ascent after 22 minutes. The total dive
time
was thirty minutes and again we did a five minute safety stop at five
metres. The dive itself had been unremarkable. There had been no
problems
and it was a slow and relaxed dive. Both divers were in good spirits
and
Post by Jon Mathers
feeling well after the dive although the female was showing some signs
of
Post by Jon Mathers
slight sea sickness on the return trip.
After the dives, the usual debriefs and paperwork were completed and the
group enjoyed a pleasant lunch together.
The subject of flying and driving (back to Canberra) after diving was
raised
and discussed. I advised the students of the PADI recommendations in
regards to flying after diving and emphasised that this was still an
inexact
science. We further discussed the issue of driving back over the
mountains
to Canberra and my advice was to reiterate the PADI view but to suggest
that
each individual diver had to take responsibility for his or her own
decision
in this regard. I further explained that, in my case, I would normally
wait
for about six hours before going over the mountain.
In the event, my partner and I head off from Merimbula sometime later
and
Post by Jon Mathers
the other three divers a little while after us. In the event, the time
between their last dive and the time they hit the foot of the mountains
was
slightly over six hours. About two hours later, I received a phone call
from the female diver telling me that she was at Cooma and not feeling
very
well. I asked about here symptoms and she explained that she felt
nauseous,
had a headache and she had pins and needles. Naturally, I was very
concerned. I instructed her to immediately go to the Cooma hospital.
I
Post by John Nicholson
Post by Jon Mathers
immediately rang DAN, spoke with the duty doctor, and he arranged for an
immediate evacuation (by a low flying aircraft) to Sydney. By this
time,
Post by Jon Mathers
the woman's condition was deteriorating and it was becoming very
probable
Post by Jon Mathers
that she was suffering from DCI.
That's the circumstances. What was the result? The woman did indeed
have
Post by Jon Mathers
very serious DCI and she spent several weeks undertaking hyperbaric
chamber
treatment in Sydney. She was not allowed to return to Canberra for
several
weeks, not allowed to fly for several months (meaning she had to
cancel
Post by John Nicholson
a
Post by Jon Mathers
planned overseas trip) and told never to dive again. For several months
thereafter she continued to have deadness in parts of her hands and arms
and
has experienced other complications as well. Now, after more than
twelve
Post by Jon Mathers
months, she is relatively well but it seems as though she will never
return
to full capacity. As I said, she can never dive again.
Personally, I have gone over the circumstances in my mind many, many
times
Post by Jon Mathers
to see if I could or should have done anything different. Although I am
terribly saddened by the events I do not blame myself for what happened.
We
kept well within the PADI tables and we followed all the rules.
Nevertheless, a fellow human being suffered a very bad injury as a
result
Post by Jon Mathers
of
the diving activity.
I now have the habit of setting all my open water students the task of
examining the dives we did on the Sunday and asking them to see if they
are
'safe' dives according to the PADI tables. Of course, they do satisfy
the
Post by Jon Mathers
tables and the students, having completed the exercise are clear in
their
Post by Jon Mathers
mind that the dives would be ok. I then quietly and gently explain to
them
what actually happened and encourage them to accept that the PADI
tables,
Post by Jon Mathers
like all others and all computer algorithms are nothing more than
statiistical likelihoods. If they follow the rules, they are likely
to
Post by John Nicholson
be
Post by Jon Mathers
ok but nothing in life, as the diver who got the DCI can attest, is
certain.
I hope others might find this story mildly interesting.
John
Loading...